Discussion in 'Politics and Current Events' started by KBrown, Jan 11, 2017.

  1. Shane3

    Shane3 Member Who Talks (A Lot!)

    Today was one of the strangest days in American history. I hope Trump is able to control the CIA.

    Trump conducts his own sting operation to ensnare intelligence briefers – and says he caught them leaking
    • President-elect Donald Trump described a sting operation he says he conducted after becoming infuriated by a series of leaks about his own classified briefings
    • He says he decided to tell no one about a particular secret briefing, shielding even his longtime scheduling aide, Rhona Graff, to rule out the possibility leaks were coming from his staff
    • When word got out anyway, Trump concluded it was the intelligence community who was putting out information
    • He described the operation he conducted after suggesting intelligence officials leaked a fake dirty dossier of information about him

    Read more:
    Follow us: @MailOnline on Twitter | DailyMail on Facebook
  2. KBrown

    KBrown Member Who Talks (A Lot!)

    That's step two of tyranny. Step one is to discredit and control the media.
    Hiphopster likes this.
  3. Hiphopster

    Hiphopster Member Who Talks (A Lot!)

    A relatively small but unmistakable step towards authoritarianism was represented in Donald's presser yesterday.
  4. JG

    JG Member Who Talks (A Lot!)

    I've been talking to Hip through this...I had that surgery about 15 years ago, and it sucks like hell.

    I would not wish this on anyone, even Duke.
    Hiphopster likes this.
  5. bHero

    bHero Member Who Talks (A Lot!)

    Well the "media" didn't need much help, did they? They've been discrediting themselves since he started campaigning.
    TrueLonghornFan and horn78 like this.
  6. bHero

    bHero Member Who Talks (A Lot!)

    Republicans were saying the exact same things ya'll are 8 years ago. Just a quick PSA.
  7. Hiphopster

    Hiphopster Member Who Talks (A Lot!)

    Can you elaborate on this please? In what ways did Obama attempt to take the wheels out from underneath the 4th estate, wholesale, like DJT did yesterday?

    And btw, just because it was stated 8 years ago, does not mean it was rooted in fact. There are cases of nut jobs being on the loose, ya know?
  8. bHero

    bHero Member Who Talks (A Lot!)

    I'm just saying that every time the dems win the pubs act all armageddony and claim its the antichrist and hitler returned. And anytime the pubs win the dems do the same things. It's funny. And it's the same thing over and over and over again. Pick a president and read opposition work on them. Reagan was a racist, Carter a communist, yada yada yada.
    Selvinsankle likes this.
  9. Hiphopster

    Hiphopster Member Who Talks (A Lot!)

    Clinton was a murderer...yada yada yada. You skipped over the presidency wherein this went to a whole different level.

    The pubs are the guilty party when it comes to playing more than hardball. They started the train moving down the disloyal opposition tracks. And they perfected the game of sitting on your hands and doing nothing to help govern the know for the good of the country and all.

    This is not an equal blame game. And shame on you for trying to make it so.
  10. bHero

    bHero Member Who Talks (A Lot!)

    Remember when Lincoln was killed by a democrat? And JFK by either a Republican or the Russians (odd... same boogeymen today?). And lets not even start on Hoover. Holy cow.

    You keep acting like this is a partisan or political party issue. Or even a new one. That's cute.

    I wonder when you'll realize your hero's Pelosi, Soros and Schumer aren't paragons for social justice?
  11. Hiphopster

    Hiphopster Member Who Talks (A Lot!)

    Why highlight those three? I'm talking more about the populace than the leaders right now
  12. bHero

    bHero Member Who Talks (A Lot!)

    1) There's not "he started this" to the discussion. It's been going on forever. Blaming whoever you think started it or ranking evil is non-productive. There is no good justification or rationale for it. And our job as citizens is to run the other guy out of town when it's exposed, but no when it's made up. That's getting harder to figure out with the crap in the news today.

    2) You don't get to draw lines for the other side if you are at war with them. You don't get to tell them what is okay escalation and what's not.

    3) Both sides are equally dirty, and especially the leaders.

    4) This will keep escalating as long as people think:
    a) it's either a republican or democrats fault and
    b) either republicans or democrats can fix this
    c) one is more at blame than the other
    d) you have to be on one side or the other.

    None of those are true. But people have to see their party isn't perfect and the other side isn't full or monsters before than can change. And they have to realize "outsiders" are messing with the process and our money.
    TrueLonghornFan likes this.
  13. Shane3

    Shane3 Member Who Talks (A Lot!)

    Nice rant. Except this didn't start with Clinton, and it's not exclusively a Pub problem. Have you heard of Operation Mockingbird?

    After leaving The Washington Post in 1977, Carl Bernstein spent six months looking at the relationship of the CIA and the press during the Cold War years. His 25,000-word cover story, published in Rolling Stone on October 20, 1977, is reprinted below.


    How Americas Most Powerful News Media Worked Hand in Glove with the Central Intelligence Agency and Why the Church Committee Covered It Up
  14. bHero

    bHero Member Who Talks (A Lot!)

    Ol Carl Bernstein. He's an FBI prostitute. Don't forget they've used him for decades to attack the CIA in the little slap fight between the two.
  15. bHero

    bHero Member Who Talks (A Lot!)

    Both sides have been meddling in US politics for decades.
    Deep Throat
    Nation Student Association
    Hoover... yikes.
    Hillary Email
    Tump Leaks
    Truman Leaks
    70' FBI surveillance of MLK

    and on and on and on and on...

    It's usually FBI = Republican, CIA = Democrat. That's the usual anyway.
  16. KBrown

    KBrown Member Who Talks (A Lot!)

    What do you mean by this? How has their coverage of Trump "discredited themselves"?
  17. KBrown

    KBrown Member Who Talks (A Lot!)


    There are always a set of people who claim the other side are tyrants. "Republicans" claimed Obama was going to take everyone's guns away. For example.

    Unlike those accusations, you can point to very precise, actual actions by Trump that are following the pattern.

    Praising a Russian dictator and criticizing the sitting president of the US, for example. When the Dixie Chicks criticized Bush while in Europe, there was a massive uproar. Trump does it... "meh".

    You can try to equivalence class conspiracy and paranoia with actual events, but that doesn't make it true. Someone referenced Rise and Fall of the Third Reich. Read the first few chapters, the parallels should scare you.
    Hiphopster likes this.
  18. Hiphopster

    Hiphopster Member Who Talks (A Lot!) out with a piece labeling Mc Cain as "treacherous and treasonous."

    I love the right eating their own. Especially when they are attacking the patriotism of a man that endured years of torture in SE Asian jungles. A man that turned down a chance to go home during his stay.

    Can I just quickly say a big **** YOU to the chicken hawk vaginas that would ever think of saying such a thing.

    Reminds me of the chicken**** Trump attack on him too....he likes soldiers that "weren't captured." A party worth a **** would have punished him for thinking such a thing, let alone given him the nomination. **** you DJT.
  19. bHero

    bHero Member Who Talks (A Lot!)

    Geez @KBrown.

    Democrats were just as serious during the Bush year. I can give you over 100 references on just Bush Jr. You guys really need to get a grip.

    Here's a few (google search the quote for the reference, I'm too lazy to go back and link it):

    In his New York Post column of Wednesday, August 20, 2003, page 29, entitled “In the Land of Bush Haters,” Rich Lowry writes:
    “President Bush is routinely portrayed as a Nazi on left-wing Web sites, which post pictures of Bush with a Hitler mustache and sell T-shirts with Bush’s name spelled with a Swastika.”, wrote in an article titled “Bush and Hitler: The Strategy of Fear”:

    “It’s going a bit far to compare the Bush of 2003 to the Hitler of 1933. Bush simply is not the orator that Hitler was. But comparisons of the Bush administration’s fear-mongering tactics to those practiced so successfully and with such terrible results by Hitler and Goebbels [….] are not at all out of line. Hitler would be proud that an American president is emulating him in so many ways.”

    During the 2004 presidential campaign, the left-wing website, financed by Marxist billionaire George Soros, posted a picture of George Bush wearing a Hitler mustache. This was far from an isolated incident on that website, which is one of the biggest over-users of the “Republicans are Nazis” mantra.

    June 2004, Al Gore accused Republicans of working with “rapid response digital Brownshirts.” the usual comparison of Republicans to Nazis.

    Linda Ronstadt said the Bush administration is a “new bunch of Hitlers.” (04-campaign)
    ....then called the Bush administration “a bunch of new Hitlers.” (Announced on Sean Hannity WABC radio show, Thursday, November 18, 2004)

    On Monday, July 8, 2002, Jesse Jackson struck again when he condemned George W. Bush’s political tactics during the 2000 presidential campaign as “Nazi-like”

    In April 2005, a special judicial panel ruled that veteran appellate court judge Guido Calabresi violated ethics rules by likening President Bush to Mussolini and Hitler.

    On May 5, 2005, ...Barbara Streisand ...
    “Bush’s actions remind me of Herman Goering’s quote during the Nuremberg Trials, where he stated: ‘Voice or no voice, the people can always be brought to the bidding of the leaders. All you have to do is tell them they are being attacked, and denounce the pacifists for lack of patriotism. [….]'”

    Cindy Sheehan - August 2005, compared Defense Secretary Donald Rumsfeld to “Hitler and Stalin.”

    Robert F. Kennedy Jr. accused Republicans of using Nazi and Fascist tactics during the 2004 presidential campaign. (Interview with Sean Hannity on WABC Radio, Wednesday, August 4, 2004)

    On January 2005, Ted Turner - comparing the Fox News Channel to Hitler.

    Harry “Bongos” Belafonte - January 21, 2006, when he said the department employed “gestapo-like tactics.”

    Julian Bond. February 2006, - “Republican flag and the Nazi flag fly side by side.”

    Senator Byrd, in March 2005 - speech on the Senate floor - compared Republican efforts to end a Democrat filibuster of President Bush’s court nominees to Adolph Hitler’s manipulations of the law

    Shirer compared Bush I to Hitler for trying to outlaw flag burning.

    Kurt Vonnegut “The only difference between Bush and Hitler is that Hitler was elected.”

    The Patriot Act was the beginning of his Dictatorship!!!

    Charles Rangel - The Iraq War was the Holocaust! “This is just as bad as the 6 million Jews being killed."

    Durbin - Gitmo to Nazi concentration camps!!!

    John Glenn compared Republican arguments to Nazi propaganda. “It’s the old Hitler business… if you hear something repeated, repeated, you start to believe it.”

    Democratic Senator Robert Byrd, a former Klansman, compared Bush to Hitler stooge Herman Goering. Byrd, who had filibustered the Civil Rights Act, also compared efforts to block Democratic filibusters to Nazi Germany.

    And there are sites dedicated Bush's attempt at the 4rd reicht: Hitler Comparison

    And more stories:

    Oh, look new DNC chair to be Ellision did it also:

    And real stupidity:****ler17.jpg [​IMG]


    Get the point?

    And every time, it's "this" Republican that's really really the next Hitler.

    Get a grip, quit falling for the propaganda.
    jhablinski, TexasPalladin and horn78 like this.
  20. bHero

    bHero Member Who Talks (A Lot!)

    Guess who else tried to cozy up to Putin?

  21. bHero

    bHero Member Who Talks (A Lot!)

    Guess who else criticized the sitting US President?

  22. bHero

    bHero Member Who Talks (A Lot!)

    I really hope you guys learn to quit letting political website manipulate you.

    "Dog whistles..."
  23. bHero

    bHero Member Who Talks (A Lot!)

    McCain is a turd, he's been one since before he ran for president, then became a Maverick turd. Not everyone has blind loyalty just because of part affiliation. Soldiers don't like McCain either. Ex-military like me respect his scarifies, but hate his politics.
  24. bHero

    bHero Member Who Talks (A Lot!)

    Besides the polling, characterization, and shading rally coverage and mocking him? And then being wrong about everything?

    That's both sides, FOX, CNN, MSNBC and NYT. I "turned" after this election cycle because of it.
  25. Shane3

    Shane3 Member Who Talks (A Lot!)

    Paranoid much?
    horn78 likes this.
  26. Shane3

    Shane3 Member Who Talks (A Lot!)

    Unfortunately very few are willing to look at both sides.
  27. KBrown

    KBrown Member Who Talks (A Lot!)

    Provide three sources where Bush II accused a national news agency of being "fake".

    Yes, every president since Hitler has been accused by the other side as being Hitler. So what?

    Trump is systematically calling into question the legitimacy of democracy, the legitimacy of the intelligence agencies, the legitimacy of the press. These are all right out of the tyrant playbook.

    Obama never did any of these. Bush II never did any of these. Clinton never did.... No president ever has done anything of the sort. It's dangerous.
  28. KBrown

    KBrown Member Who Talks (A Lot!)

    Do you want to discuss the topic and the specifics? Or stick to ad hominems?
  29. KBrown

    KBrown Member Who Talks (A Lot!)

    There's a difference... huge difference... between "opposing side accuses president of wanting to be a tyrant" with "incoming (or current) president actually takes actions a tyrant would take".
  30. KBrown

    KBrown Member Who Talks (A Lot!)

    Polling: Are you accusing them of intentionally lying in the polls?

    Characterization: They played clips of him. Be specific, where did the media lie about Trump?

    Mocking him? So now you're for political correctness?
  31. Shane3

    Shane3 Member Who Talks (A Lot!)

    You made your position quite plain. Obama didn't destroy America and Trump won't destroy America. Stop being so frightened.
  32. bHero

    bHero Member Who Talks (A Lot!)

    You should google your claims. It will save me the time.

    Obama certainly attacked Fox News, and on multiple occasions. Creating narrow criteria for delegitimization of press like using the phrase "fake news" wouldnt work. Cavuto has several easy ones up now from Obama in his video on Fox. Watch and enjoy.

    Not sure what you mean by democracy, if that's elections I think we know that's sport for both sides every time.

    The intelligence agencies are politicized. He's playing politics. Regardless, google will give you several claims from several presidents.

    Bush's Patriot Act was right out of the Tyrant Playbook according to many. Obama nationalizing health was too. Every election their are claims that THIS time the president it really trying to do it.

    A) You give Trump way too much credit.
    B) You give the American People very little.
    C) You give The Constitution even less.

    Even if he was Hitler's - Mousollini clone raised by Stalin he could never do anything resembling dictatorship. The constitution prevents it, congress wouldn't allow it, and the people would rebel against it.

    But he's not a clone. He's a reality television, real estate developer. He's not an evil genius. He's not even an evil advanced placement student.

    The fact that you are entertaining this hysteria is genuinely surprising.
    jhablinski, Halas and RepOfTexas like this.
  33. Shane3

    Shane3 Member Who Talks (A Lot!)

    I believe we're witnessing CNN-induced Trump-phobia. I didn't think it was real until I met a college student a few days ago who was almost in tears about Trump winning the election. Sheesh. Grow up.
    bHero likes this.
  34. bHero

    bHero Member Who Talks (A Lot!)

    I saw some pubs get really worked up when Obama won in'08. Smart people, passionate, just got a little carried away by the season.
    Shane3 likes this.
  35. Shane3

    Shane3 Member Who Talks (A Lot!)

    Agreed. It goes both ways. The strangest thing I saw, when Obama got elected, was a group of Dems who were convinced Obama was the new Hitler. They even had signs with Obama sporting the Hitler mustache. I tried talking with them but they were flat crazy.
  36. bHero

    bHero Member Who Talks (A Lot!)

    Every president gets it. It's been the favorite boogeyman pushed from the democratic side on republicans along with Russia theories.., but plenty of bogeymen to go around. We just need to question their sources, and their sources motives and their sources actual arguments.
  37. KBrown

    KBrown Member Who Talks (A Lot!)

    As soon as Trump's actions aren't frightening.
  38. KBrown

    KBrown Member Who Talks (A Lot!)

    The fact that you aren't willing to rebut any of the parallels I've listed indicates you know deep down it's not "hysteria".

    And you're still trying to equate one president criticizing specific things a network may have said with a president telling CNN they're "fake news". With a president repeatedly saying "dishonest media". These are not equivalent.

    Saying "intelligence is politicized" is a cop-out. Trump's statements that the intelligence community needed extra time to get their story straight is far beyond any criticism any other president has sent their way.

    And "rigged election" of course. That's what I mean by attacking the core of democracy.
    Last edited: Jan 13, 2017
  39. RepOfTexas

    RepOfTexas Member Who Talks (A Lot!)

    As long as you believe that then they (the two parties but in your specific case the Democrats) have you right where they want you.
    bHero likes this.
  40. bHero

    bHero Member Who Talks (A Lot!)

    No man, it indicates that I find this whole line of thought embarrassing. There are literally hundreds of examples of presidents attacking intel, the press and elections.
    TexasPalladin likes this.

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